Dungeons&Dragons: Adventures in Forgotten Realms Baseless Speculation

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Post by AvalonAurora » 1 month ago

A thread for random hopes/wishes/speculation for Dungeons & Dragons: Adventures in the Forgotten Realms, which releases approximately Q3 in 2021, set symbol looking a bit like a Red Dragon head shape in a hexagon.

I have mixed feelings about this, I'm excited that they might do it well, and dreading that they'll do it poorly. There are a ton of notes I hope they'll hit, but I know they can't hit it all, although I'm hopeful they'll hit a lot of important ones. Feel free to share your own ideas/feelings/speculation/hopes, etc. for the set in this thread.

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Post by Legend » 1 month ago

Dungeons & Dragons: Adventures in the Forgotten Realms is a Magic set?
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Post by AvalonAurora » 1 month ago

One of my key hopes for this set is that they make sure to hit the 'Dungeons & Dragons' aspect of things, which to me, means the trio of 'treasure' found in Dungeons, traps found in Dungeons, and Dragons. Along those lines I hope we get a return of treasure or gold artifact tokens, as well as a return of traps, or something similar to it, from the original Zendikar block. And for dragons, I hope we at least get the iconic 'Red Dragon' in classical D&D style, not red as in the MtG color necessarily though, Red as in of the chromatic dragons of D&D and the Forgotten Realms, more than one dragon card would be appreciated, since the title includes plural of Dragon, in the form of 'Dragons'.

Another thing I somewhat hope for is saga cards based on major events in the forgotten realms, like the Time of Troubles, Spellplague, and Second Sundering.

While not a high priority compared to many other things, it might be nice to see some legendary lands based on key locations in the realms that have been a focus for players for various reasons, such as the video games, or other well detailed locations, perhaps where major popular pre-published adventures took place. For instance, it would be nice to have legendary lands for Baulder's Gate, the City of Neverwinter, Icewind Dale, and Sigil.

I also hope the bulk of instant, sorcery, and enchantment spells in the set represent actual spells/rituals one cast in dungeons and dragons, some of which might be reprints where things have the same name and are similar enough, like Fireball, but some would be new to Magic: the Gathering. For instance, perhaps there could be an Azorious colored spell called 'Dispel Magic' which is a modal spell with both disenchant and counterspell modes. I hope they touch on a lot of classic D&D spells this way, especially any whose names aren't already used in existing MtG spells.

For creatures, I hope they pay some special attention to iconic creatures that Wizards of the Coast owns the rights to, like the Mind Flayer/Illithid, which was left out of the 3.5 SRD on purpose for reasons related to that. I also hope they cover a wide range of bases of major creature types from D&D, including Aberration, Animal, Construct, Dragon, Elemental, Fey, Giant, Humanoid, Magical Beast, Monstrous Humanoid, Ooze, Outsider, Plant, Undead, and Vermin in the context of 3.5 edition, or Aberration, Beast, Celestial, Construct, Dragon, Elemental, Fey, Fiend, Giant, Humanoid, Monstrosity, Ooze, Plant, Swarm of Tiny Beasts, and Undead by 5e terms.

Some key ones to cover in that context might include Illithid, Stirge, Solar, Shield Guardian, Red Dragon, Xorn, Blink Dog, Night Hag, Balor, Cloud Giant, Mimic, Gelatinous Cube, Treant, and Dracolich, along with adventurers of the key PHB races.

Might be nice to have some interesting legendary creatures as well, such as Elminster, Drizzt Do'Urden, Halaster Blackcloak, a Manshoon, or Alustriel Silverhand.

Might also be nice to have some non-legendary creature representatives of various organizations, such as a Harper Agent card, a Cult of the Dragon cultist card, a Lord's Alliance agent card, an Order of the Gauntlet knight card, an undead Red Wizard card, and/or a Zhentarim agent card.

I hope some of the artifacts are common magic items in the realms, or legendary artifacts of the realms, such as Elminster's eversmoking pipe, or Ioun stones.

I hope even some of the basic lands look like various places that can possibly be identified to some degree in the realms, perhaps based on scenes adapted from things from rulebooks or video games, or that have well recognized landmarks in the distant backgrounds.

I also hope some of the gods are represented in some way, if not in cards as god type cards, then perhaps in cleric cards dedicated to them or something (possibly multi-class ones in some cases, like a typeline of 'elf cleric archer' for something, or 'human cleric knight').

I also hope we see some spells that have the names of their creators in them, for creators who originated in the Realms (rather than ones from other settings like Greyhawk), such as Aganazzar's scorcher, or Simbul's synostodweomer.

I suspect regardless of what we want, we'll probably see a return of the party mechanic from the recent Zendikar set, although I'd prefer something like the level up mechanic or allies.

I'm wondering what type halflings will be, a new 'halfling' type, will they give them the kithkin type just because of being similar small races despite the halflings lacking anything like the thoughtweft? Some other name, like perhaps 'hobbit' depending on the legalities of such?

Might be nice for MtG to have more than one non-artifact gnome card as well.

I'd prioritize flavor and relative mechanical simplicity of core sets over actual power levels, given that it sounds like the set is taking the place of a core set, but I really hope the flavor ends up being a home run.

I also hope they don't make too many good things that are flavor locked in ways that make reprints harder, so a lot of the better spells or creatures I hope are ones with more generic names and types and mechanics and such.

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Post by AvalonAurora » 1 month ago

Legend wrote:
1 month ago
Dungeons & Dragons: Adventures in the Forgotten Realms is a Magic set?
Yes, in this announcement:

https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/a ... 2020-09-01

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Post by Legend » 1 month ago

AvalonAurora wrote:
1 month ago
Legend wrote:
1 month ago
Dungeons & Dragons: Adventures in the Forgotten Realms is a Magic set?
Yes, in this announcement:

https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/a ... 2020-09-01
Funny because back in the 90s players begged for a DnD set but MaRo stated they'd never do a crossover because it would be "jumping the shark". I'm cool with it though. I was one of those players. I'm sure it's going to be awesome. And I'm sure it'll have "level up".
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Post by void_nothing » 1 month ago

I would imagine we'll see a lot of D&D monsters that have been previously impossible to port as Magic creatures. Beholders (typed with Eye or possibly Beholder), displacer beasts (typed Cat Beast), and driders (typed Elf Spider) all come to mind.
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Post by AliasBot » 1 month ago

I'm probably most curious how the set's planeswalker cards will be handled. (There will be planeswalker cards, that much I'm sure of: there hasn't been a standard-legal set without them since the very early days of the card type, over ten years ago. Even non-standard card products almost always include PW cards these days.)

...since we're in Baseless Speculation, I'll throw out my guess: we'll get the full five monocolor walkers typical of the core set that AFR is replacing, with each being a new character from a different major D&D setting - one actually from the Forgotten Realms, the rest from elsewhere.

(Per a Wizards survey, the five most popular D&D settings are the Realms, Eberron, Ravenloft, Planescape, and Dark Sun - not necessarily in that order, save for the Realms being in an unambiguous first place - so maybe one from each of those? An artificer from Eberron, a psionics user from Dark Sun/Athas, a planetouched tied to Planescape/Sigil, some sort of horror nonsense from Ravenloft, and maybe a cleric from the Realms? Not sure where you'd find a Green 'walker out of that selection, but...)
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Post by Mookie » 1 month ago

Well, I'm looking forward to the set. I would definitely expect the iconic character classes to be represented, especially with Party showing up in ZNR as a plant for them. As the 'adventure world', Zendikar has actually covered a lot of the existing D&D tropes - traps, adventuring parties, quests - so it will be interesting to see which ones return and which ones get reimagined. I suppose that core sets tend to be pretty light on new mechanics though... and while this isn't technically a core set, I still wouldn't expect it to be super experimental either.

I guess one thing I'll note is that WotC mentioned that they were planning to mechanically tie together all the upcoming sets with DFCs - ZNR already had them, and they've been confirmed for Kaldheim and the Innistrad sets too. Will be interesting to see if they also show up in the D&D set.

As for other things I'll expect... iconic monsters are to be expected (dragons, zombies, beholders, liches, etc)... but a lot of those already exist in MTG. I'm actually more excited for adventuring gear. Bag of Holding is already a card, but stuff like Rings of Protection, Cloaks of Resistance, and Ioun Stones would also be sweet to see.

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Post by CommanderMaster999 » 1 month ago

Well i can begin with quite a bit of the most famous characters getting cards

Tiamat For example as a new 5-color legend (I definatly want her she literally has a head of every color in Magic's colors)

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Post by Krishnath » 1 month ago

I just hope they don't turn Elminster or Drizz't into planeswalkers. Halaster on the other hand would make a fine planeswalker, he was weird to begin with and other than making the undermountain and basically being immortal he isn't really a major player in the FR.
One fun note that could prove Halaster to be a planeswalker is the following little thing from the FR wiki:
After the Second Sundering, it was revealed that Halaster's ritual had not slain the Mad Mage, but instead scattered his essence across the planes, with the warping influence of the Spellplague preventing it from being reformed within Undermountain. With the Spellplague finally ended and magic restored to its former stability, Halaster was able to recorporate himself and returned to Undermountain, resuming his normal activities as if he had never been gone.
That sounds a lot like a planeswalker to me.


As for creatures. There are two very specific creatures they need to include to make fans of D&D happy, and neither one is Dragon. The Illithid and the Beholder, bonus point if they also include the Aboleth to make the Aberration unholy trinity. And lets be honest here, no existing MTG creature type would do them justice, they *need* the aberration type, because no other typing would do. The Illithid race literally escaped from the end of the universe, the Beholder is from a place outside of all universes (called the Far Realms), and the Aboleth, well, it is a remnant of the previous universe, and it remembers *everything*, including the first meal their great, great, great grandparents ate. Now, if you think that there is an existing creature type that works for those three, please share it, because there isn't one.


The set will without a doubt have at least five dragons in it, and some sort of "dungeon" mechanic.


Sagas is a must, but I don't think we are going to get "gods" in the set, the setting has so many, and if they stick to just five, fans of the others will complain. There are literally dozens upon dozens of gods in the setting.
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Post by void_nothing » 1 month ago

You know, it is kind of interesting that the chromatic dragon colors happen to be Magic's mana colors.
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Post by Krishnath » 1 month ago

void_nothing wrote:
1 month ago
You know, it is kind of interesting that the chromatic dragon colors happen to be Magic's mana colors.
True, but their personalities don't match the color philosophies, white dragons for example are brutish thugs and blue dragons don't actually value knowledge, at all.
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Post by 5colorsrainbow » 1 month ago

My guesses:

-As this takes the place of a core set I don't except too much out there stuff, mostly like we saw with Magic Origins but with DnD flavor instead of the origins 5 and the two planes related to them. Mostly what we see in core sets but with dwarfs, mind flayers and beholders.

-On that note I do think we'd see DnD creatures get magic types and not new ones if possible, so no tieflings creature type they be Azra.

-The 5 walkers will be mtg characters and have promo art with them doing DnD like stuff.

-The legends however will all be DnD characters, likely a cycle plus a few random ones.

-I think we will see a few MDFC but not a huge amount as again core set.

-Only mtg original flavor outside the walkers will only be in art from the cards they reprint and don't get new art.
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Post by AvalonAurora » 1 week ago

Just thought of a cool thing I kinda hope they have something like:

A 'you win the game' effect which requires you to have at least one treasure token, at least one dragon creature, a certain minimum number of walls, and a certain minimum number of instant trap spells (a-la the stuff from Zendikar) either in the graveyard or revealed from your hand. Perhaps that you could only pull off the check to see if you instant win with such if there isn't an opponent with a full party?

Might also be nice if they snuck in some D&D joke references, like perhaps a non-basic land with a picture of a gazebo in the art with an adventurer quoted in the flavor text of the land mistaking someone talking about a gazebo with it being a monster? Or perhaps a doppleganger card that references disguising itself as Drizzt in the flavor text or is pictured transforming into Drizzt, to make a joke about players playing 'Drizzt clones'?

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Post by Krishnath » 1 week ago

AvalonAurora wrote:
1 week ago
Just thought of a cool thing I kinda hope they have something like:

A 'you win the game' effect which requires you to have at least one treasure token, at least one dragon creature, a certain minimum number of walls, and a certain minimum number of instant trap spells (a-la the stuff from Zendikar) either in the graveyard or revealed from your hand. Perhaps that you could only pull off the check to see if you instant win with such if there isn't an opponent with a full party?

Might also be nice if they snuck in some D&D joke references, like perhaps a non-basic land with a picture of a gazebo in the art with an adventurer quoted in the flavor text of the land mistaking someone talking about a gazebo with it being a monster? Or perhaps a doppleganger card that references disguising itself as Drizzt in the flavor text or is pictured transforming into Drizzt, to make a joke about players playing 'Drizzt clones'?
According to Maro, the people doing the D&D set were offered the Party mechanic from Zen Rising (which would then have gotten another mechanic to use), but turned it down as they had their own thing going on. So it is very unlikely that it is going to show up in the set or even referenced.

But unless there is a card called Magic Missile in the set, I'll be a very sad dragon.
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Post by Krishnath » 1 week ago

So I've been thinking a bit about this set and of course D&D, specifically the Forgotten Realms setting it is set in, and I've come to some conclusions:

There will be drow, that means we will get both green and black aligned elves.

We will be getting at least one reference, either as a card or in flavor text, to the Netherese.

We'll be getting at least one gnoll, possibly several. That means Hyena Warriors.

The main villain of the set will be aligned either with Bane, Baal, or Auril, if not one of the three themselves. I am leaning towards Auril as the Frostmaiden is the current big bad for the campaign setting adventures.

There will be at least one Dragonborn. It'll either get a new creature type (Dragonborn) or be a Dragon "whatever". I am leaning towards the former.

All the classes of the PHB will get card representation. That includes the Warlock (and let's be honest, we need more warlocks).

The aberration creature type will make its first appearance. Expect to see more creatures with the type in the future. We'll get a Beholder and an Illithid/Mindflayer to tie in with the new Baldur's Gate game. We might possibly get an Aboleth as well, and if we are lucky the Carrion Crawler.

I fully expect a large number of Instants, Sorceries, and Enchantments be references to spells in D&D, although I do not expect a Lightning Bolt reprint, we'll get a variant named Call Lightning. We will also get a Fireball reprint.

We will get Halflings, but the question will be whether they have a new creature type or they decide to use the Kithkin type.

There will be at least three, but maybe as many as six dragons, at least one of which will be Legendary. The Legendary Dragon will not be Tiamat, but rather Ashardalon.

There will be a cycle of colored legendary equipment.

There will be at least one D&D style Naga, likely a Dark Naga or a Banelar.

There will be at least one Felldrake.

We will get one new planeswalker, native to Faerûn. Either someone completely new or Halaster, because Halaster is probably the one established character in the realms I would expect to have the spark, he's just that crazy awesome.

There will be references to both Elminster and Drizz't Do'Urden, but they will not appear themselves.

There will be lizardfolk and giants, possibly even frost or fire salamanders.

We might get a named demon from the lore that is not a demon prince, my bet is on the villain from Icewind Dale.

The Wizards of Thay will make an appearance.

There will be a Kraken, and it will be awesome.

The Tarrasque will not make an appearance, if it did, it would be at least a 20/20 indestructible creature, and that wouldn't be fun. It would be awesome, but it wouldn't be fun. Nor do I expect to see the Elfeater or Dendar the Night Serpent, for similar reasons.

There will be a cycle of new uncommon color fixing lands, they will become Commander staples.

There will be a minor multicolor theme.

Some, but not all, the gods of Faerûn will be referenced in some way, but none of them will get a creature card. I expect references to the most well known gods, and a handful of obscure ones.

There will be one dinosaur. It'll be a reference to the Jungles of Chult. It'll be rare.

Adventures will return.
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